The stress of the exam period and what students would change in the Romanian education system

“I think it can make you forget everything and lose yourself in that moment.”

Rodica: Hello and welcome to the Mental Health for Romania podcast! My name is Rodica, and I’m a psychological counsellor, and today I’m joined by Larisa.

Larisa: Hello! I’m Larisa, a researcher in psychiatry and neuroscience.

Rodica: And alongside Larisa, we also have a few student volunteers from our organisation joining us today. With the exam period approaching, we thought it would be a good opportunity to record a podcast about the experiences of high school students as they approach their exams, so I’ll let them introduce themselves.

Patricia: Hi, I’m Patricia, and I’m in 10th grade.

Amelia: Hi! I’m Amelia, and I’m in 10th grade.

Mara: Hi! I’m Mara, and I’m in 10th grade.

Andreea: Hi! I’m Andreea, and I’m in 11th grade.

Volunteer: Hi! I’m in 11th grade.

Paula: Hi! I’m Paula, and I’m in 11th grade.

Rodica: Thank you for introducing yourselves, girls! Now that we’re a little more familiar with the topic, we can get started with the questions. Think back to a time you’ve already been through where your emotions or stress became particularly intense in the context of tests and exams, and tell us whether you’ve ever found yourselves in a situation like this. And if so, how did that stress or those strong emotions manifest themselves? What can you tell us about your experience?

Patricia: I know the exams are coming up, including for the younger students in 8th grade. I was in that position myself just two years ago, and all I can say is that I was very confident and thought, no… there’s absolutely no way anything is going to happen to me. But then, during the maths exam, I had quite an unpleasant experience. I had 10 minutes left of the exam and decided to hand in my paper, but the teacher supervising us said there was a mark on the page and that if I didn’t rewrite the entire paper in 10 minutes, they wouldn’t accept it. And at that point, to be honest, I was just like, “Wow, this can’t be happening. I have to do something, I have to, I have to, no, no, no.” And I think that, in a split second, this feeling just came over me—fear, anxiety, I was feeling everything, almost as if I was living in 10 different universes at once. Everything was so, so strange, and I had my pen in my hand but I literally couldn’t write. I’d never experienced anything like that before. I remember trying, really trying, to pull myself together, but it didn’t help that I could see the other students in the room getting up and handing in their papers, and everything was fine for them. I just couldn’t understand why this had happened to me when I’d gone there prepared. And in that moment, all these thoughts just took over. I was thinking about what was going to happen afterwards, rather than what I was actually writing on the paper, and my hand was shaking. I was having all sorts of thoughts, all sorts of nightmares, and those 10 minutes were the worst 10 minutes I’d ever experienced. I just couldn’t calm myself down, and even now, I don’t have a clear memory of what happened. If you asked me in more detail what happened during those 10 minutes, I wouldn’t really know what to tell you. All I remember is myself sitting there with the pen in my hand, writing like this, shaking, and that’s it. It was just very, very strange.

Amelia: For me, the stress didn’t come from being unsure that I’d do well in the exam, but from the people around me — from friends, teachers and parents. I was afraid of making mistakes on really simple things. I’d always been more confident when it came to maths, but when I think about Romanian, I was actually fine emotionally; I wasn’t particularly stressed or anything. But then, when it came to maths, I really did get nervous. I remember shaking, even though I finished quite quickly. But towards the end, I realised I’d made a mistake in a calculation and I panicked. But it all turned out fine in the end.

Mara: I don’t remember those days around the 8th grade exams very, very clearly, but what I do remember is that I was very predictable. I took about 10 pens with me, water, sweets, everything I might need, just to make sure everything was okay, and I went in feeling confident because I knew I was prepared. At the same time, as Amelia said, I was afraid of making mistakes on simple things, especially in maths or with grammar in Romanian. But before the exam, the atmosphere was actually quite familiar. I was in the same room as my classmates, and we were trying to predict what might come up in the Romanian exam and so on. But as soon as the exam started, it felt like everything changed. It was just me and the paper, and I started thinking about what people around me had told me, like, “This isn’t just a test, it’s an exam. It’s important because it will determine which high school you get into. You’ve never had anything like this before.” The atmosphere was much more stressful, knowing that you were being supervised. There were cameras there as well, and, yeah, I think the pressure I felt around the exams came less from being afraid of what would happen or of not getting into the school I wanted, and more from understanding that I’d never had an exam like this before and that it was an important step for me. And I think that was what caused the stress.

Volunteer: For me, the stress was pretty much constant throughout 7th and 8th grade. My parents insisted that I start preparing from 7th grade, both for maths and Romanian. And my Romanian tutor was from, well, the best high school, anyway, the point is that she treated me really badly, and generally treated everyone badly—both the students she tutored and the students at school. And somehow, she put this pressure on me that if I didn’t get a 10 in Romanian, even though I liked maths much more, I was a disappointment to her and the worst student she had. And before the national exam, my anxiety almost led to a severe panic attack. So I hope that the students listening to this who have to take the national exam understand that the opinion of some random teacher at a school, no matter how good that school is, doesn’t define you.

Volunteer: I didn’t feel particularly stressed by the exams because I’d been preparing for them well in advance, so to speak, and preparing consistently helped me build confidence in myself. But in the few days right before the exam, I felt really overwhelmed because the people around me already had a very good impression of me and thought I was really good at school, and my biggest fear was that my results wouldn’t live up to their expectations. That was my biggest fear. In the end, it all worked out, and I managed to get past it once I had the exam paper in front of me, but the emotions were really intense in the days leading up to the exam.

Voluntar: Personally, when it comes to the 8th grade exam, I’d say I was quite lucky because the people around me didn’t put much pressure on me. Even so, my first thought on the morning of the exam was that I was going to disappoint everyone. I wasn’t under any pressure, but I knew that everyone had very high expectations of me. But, as the girls have said, it’s not necessarily about the grade itself, but about what happens afterwards.

Larisa: You’ve already mentioned this to some extent, particularly in terms of the fear of making small mistakes. But we’re wondering, how do you think anxiety around exams can specifically affect your performance?

Volunteer: I think it can make you forget everything and lose yourself in that moment, so you need to have a bit of self-control. Personally, I don’t mean this in a negative way, but I’m actually glad I went through it. I’ve been through it now, and hopefully it won’t happen again in the future, and I’m glad to be the person I am today. Even though it happened, it helped me. I wouldn’t have been able to learn from it if it hadn’t happened.

Larisa: Mhm.

Volunteer: Coming from someone who had already been experiencing anxiety for about two years by the time I took the 8th grade exam, I knew what it was going to feel like because my anxiety tends to kick in on the morning of the event. In the evening, I had no problem at all. I could hear all my classmates panicking and joking around, and I didn’t feel anxious about it whatsoever. But I knew that once I woke up, I’d feel nauseous, shaky and dizzy. And every time I went to bed while my classmates were feeling all those nerves, I didn’t feel anything, but I knew that the following morning was going to be a nightmare, and it always was. And I really hope that… I hope no one ever has to go through that.

Volunteer: I’m also someone who has had a history of anxiety in the past, but somehow, during the exam period, it helped me not to be careless. After all, it’s quite an important exam, and it helped me realise that and focus on the details. I think I would have made a lot more mistakes both in the mock exams and in the actual exam if I hadn’t had some degree of fear that things might not go well. You can never be completely confident in yourself.

Larisa: Hmm, and would you say that this fear or stress you felt before the entrance exam, for example, was somehow fueled by your desire to do well, or do you think it was also influenced by your teachers or parents?

Mara: Personally, I think my expectations have always been higher than those of the people around me, and I’ve always had the impression that others expect great things from me. And yes, it’s true — to all my classmates and teachers, I was, yes, the straight-A student, and everyone expected me to get an A on the exam. But I didn’t want to go in either too confident — and then be disappointed — or too stressed — and then feel overwhelmed during the exam. So I think it’s important to stay balanced, to have constructive nerves, and to take only the good advice from others. And if you feel that something someone says is too much for you to handle, it’s better to focus on more encouraging things. For example, I think that when someone says something like, “Oh, you’re definitely going to get a 10,” it’s not as helpful as when someone says, “If you concentrate and pay attention, you’ll do fine” — I think that’s a bit more balanced.

Rodica: Now that you’ve told us a little bit about what those periods were like for you — or those specific moments — can you also tell us how you managed certain emotions you experienced, certain sensations, and how you perhaps calmed certain thoughts — in light of what you said was going through your minds?

Volunteer: I can say that I’m one of those unfortunate cases, and I didn’t find anything — absolutely no solution — that would calm me down, especially since it was a completely new situation for me; I’d never encountered anything like that before. And they don’t teach you in school what to do when you’re put in a situation like that. It was completely new, and I really didn’t know what to do. Well, later on, of course, I looked into it and all that, but at that moment, no — I didn’t know what to do. In all eight years of school, I was never told, “Here’s what you need to do if you’re feeling stressed or something like that”.

Rodica: And indeed, we’re talking about a specific event — the 8th-grade exam — which is important. But as you say, sometimes we may also lack certain skills for tests in general.

Mara: I think it’s important to have experience with taking exams and writing. That’s why I think — at least for me— it helped that I participated in a lot of academic competitions and contests before the exam, because I got used to that atmosphere of working under pressure and even to details like how to organize your ideas on the page or how to manage your time. And that was a plus for me because I already knew how to handle those kinds of situations. But at the same time, psychologically speaking, I can’t say I was the strongest person, and I think it’s important to rely on things like positive thinking and detachment during the exam — from the people around you, from any factor that might stress you out. And I think it’s a good idea — at least it worked for me — to close your eyes before you receive the exam paper, think about something else, take a deep breath, and try to focus on that moment, without thinking about the result.

Andreea: I had experience with academic competitions, and that helped me deal with the stress — not just the exam itself, but more than that, psychologically, it helped me talk to kids who had already taken this exam or people who had taken several exams, and they told me what it was like for them emotionally, what happened, what happened to their classmates, whether they got a lower score, what happened to them — like whether they moved or didn’t move, and whether they got along better with their classmates in the class they ended up in. I think it’s important to take an interest in this — or I would have liked to have had something like this at school, meaning for students who had graduated from our school to come and talk to us, to put our minds at ease a little.

Larisa: Yes, I think this element of familiarity that you mentioned is very important. Indeed, on the one hand, you can become familiar with the exam environment by participating in academic competitions or school contests, as you’ve also pointed out, but do you think there might be other ways we could help students become more accustomed to the stress surrounding exams, tests, and assignments during high school?

Daria: I think there’s a pretty big difference between what the girls were talking about — constructive emotions and stress that helps you grow psychologically — and anxiety that drags you down every time. And I think we aren’t taught, first and foremost, how to manage stress in general — or any kind of emotion, for that matter — not even within our families. Personally, no one ever told me, “Look, for example, these breathing exercises can help you if you have a panic attack,” and in 8th grade, we never talked about “Look, when you walk into that room, this is what’s going to happen psychologically — this might happen to you — but you need to focus on something else.” For me, personally, it was the fact that I set a goal for myself that no one else knew about, so that no one else would put pressure on me to reach that goal, and only I knew about it. But I don’t think people talk enough about just how stressful it can be.

Larisa: I completely agree.

Mara: I’d like to add here that there are probably alternatives… familiarising students with that stressful atmosphere — not necessarily through academic competitions or contests, but perhaps, say, a month or more before the exam, students shouldn’t just be doing tutoring or exam prep at school, and perhaps they could be shown — within the school setting, after class or something like that — as Daria mentioned, what might happen when you walk into the exam room, how you’ll feel, and to prepare them for those moments — to offer some advice, to help them realise that it won’t just be an intellectual test of what they’ve learned, but that it will also test their mental resilience.

Larisa: Mhm.

Volunteer: At our school, for example, we were lucky to have a Romanian teacher and a maths teacher who were both very willing to help us. They would hold extra classes with us before lessons, focusing on the academic side of things and helping us understand anything we had questions about. They were very open to that. But, for example, no one ever came to talk to us or provide any kind of psychological preparation.

Volunteer: We were also lucky to have really supportive teachers who would share some of their experiences with previous generations. The only thing I didn’t like was that they compared us quite a lot, both with each other and with previous generations. And it’s really frustrating because we’re not all the same, especially from one generation to another. The exam papers are different, and it’s annoying to think, “Well, last year, people got into this school with this grade,” when this year the papers might be either harder or easier, so that comparison is completely irrelevant.

Rodica: Thank you for sharing that with us! Now that you’ve told us a little about that bigger experience you had at the end of Year 8, what do you think you can take away from that experience? Is there anything you learnt from it that you were then able to carry with you into your high school years, or anything else you think is worth taking forward from experiences like these?

Volunteer: That these things don’t define you — I think that’s the only… not the only, but the most important thing I’ve learned. That a person is made up of so many things that you can’t reduce them to a number, a school, and a teacher. There are so many different aspects to a person, and I think the national assessment — and exams in general — make you feel as if the world is ending if you don’t get a certain grade or if you don’t meet the expectations that people have imposed on you.

Larisa: Mhm.

Volunteer: I think it’s really important to remember that there’s light at the end of the tunnel — I mean, I feel really good that I’ve gotten through this, and I’ll be able to handle situations like this in the future.

Amelia: It struck me as very ironic at the time. Everyone makes such a big deal out of the exam. But after just three months, nobody cares anymore — not you, not the teachers, not the parents; absolutely nobody cares anymore.

Rodica: Maybe no one cares about the exam itself or the result itself anymore, but the emotion that each of us feels is genuine and remains a part of our experience.

Volunteer: Ultimately, when you grow up, you won’t necessarily have exams anymore, but that stress will still be there — just in different situations. Maybe then you’ll handle it better, or maybe not.

Patricia: I find it really strange that I don’t remember exactly what happened, but the emotion is still so vivid — I mean, it’s as if… as if it happened just two seconds ago. That’s what strikes me as the strangest.

Voluntar: And as Amelia said, nobody really cares about the exam itself anymore, and somehow you just move on to the next thing. Now that we’re finishing 11th grade, the teachers have been telling us since the beginning of 11th grade: “Learn this because you won’t have time to catch up later,” “do X,” “do Y”—and I get it, they have our best interests at heart. But having so little time to adapt to this “new life”, so to speak, after putting in so much effort, is difficult.

Mara: I do agree that after a certain amount of time, once the exam is over, the value you attached to it beforehand starts to fade, and you think, “Why did I stress so much about this?” But that emotional experience has still left its mark on you, and it probably stays with you afterwards. That’s why it’s important to learn that, with the next exams — which are important too, of course — and precisely because they are important, it’s also important to look after yourself and somehow find that balance we were talking about earlier. And that applies not just to the national exam or the baccalaureate, but to any test or exam you take in your life. You need to learn how to develop constructive emotions and pay attention to detail. I think that, ultimately, that’s what’s essential in an exam.

Larisa: Mhm. And going back to this idea of working on yourself, as you said, Mara, and trying to change your perspective on things, how do you think we could get to that point, given the way schools and the education system are structured at the moment?

Volunteer: I think that, in general, the educational system is quite rigid and — not exactly old, but — backward in certain ways. I think it could be much better than it is right now because, right now, it’s designed for the majority — it’s designed for people who are, in quotes, “normal.” It’s designed for people who wouldn’t have any problems, who are confident, who feel comfortable with themselves, and who aren’t… There’s absolutely no discussion of so many taboo topics in Romania that I’ve had to figure out on my own—and I think everyone who knows about them has had to figure them out on their own. When it comes to managing stress, or knowing that you have anxiety, it was absolutely awful that I didn’t know what was happening to me, and yet I still had to give presentations and act as if nothing was wrong, because you have to put on a mask and act as if you’re okay. I think they could introduce subjects into the curriculum that really… that are truly needed on a social and psychological level — where they teach us methods for managing stress and ways to calm down… what to do when you need help, when you realise you have a problem.

Larisa: Mhm, I agree.

Volunteer: And there’s also the fact that schools have counselors and psychologists. I’ve never heard of it—I mean, there’s a sign on the door, and that’s about it. But no one ever tells you, “Look, if you have a problem — go there,” like, “You’ll be okay afterward,” or “Go there and see what it’s like.” No, nobody ever told me; I don’t even know if they actually exist or if it’s just written on the door.

Rodica: It’s kind of interesting that these things you’re mentioning happen, given that anxiety is an emotion we all deal with. It’s true that not all of us end up experiencing it at a dysfunctional level, so to speak, but it’s an emotion that comes up frequently, and we really need to find ways to manage it. All the more reason we need ways to talk openly about it and learn, from a young age, how to manage such emotions.

Volunteer: In 10 years of school, I only heard about mental health once, in 7th grade, when our homeroom teacher called in the school counselor, but she just talked vaguely about how not to be so stressed before a test— like how to manage your time and stuff. But again, very vaguely. And now, in 10th grade, I’m taking psychology with the school counselor, and she hasn’t really brought this topic up — so far, she hasn’t brought it up at all — and I find it super ironic because that’s what interests us the most: how to stay healthy, especially since we’re in the math profile and all that. But mental health really isn’t discussed at all unless another teacher takes the initiative, and that just doesn’t seem normal to me.

Mara: I’m in 10th grade, and I’m studying psychology in school, but it’s not what I expected — there’s a lot of emphasis on theory and vague concepts related to personality or memory. But I think it would be more important, for example, to teach students…, a lot of them probably don’t know what obsessive-compulsive disorder is or what chronic stress can lead to, or what kinds of disorders it can cause. And I think it’s more important to raise awareness about these kinds of things than to learn all sorts of definitions, classifications, and theories from the history of psychology. I mean, we need things that are relevant today. And I know we’re often told that we’re the “snowflake” generation — that’s what they say — that we’re very sensitive, but I think that in today’s society we feel overwhelmed by so many things, and that’s exactly why we shouldn’t be ashamed to talk about them. Schools should put more emphasis on mental health, and I think that’s how we would ultimately achieve the performance we expect. You can’t have high expectations of students who aren’t mentally prepared to cope.

Volunteer: It bothers me that we’ve somehow normalised the idea that you have to deal with your emotions about school on your own — meaning that if you feel overwhelmed, “the problem is with you,” meaning “you’re really weak if you ask for help,” you shouldn’t… “it’s not a serious enough problem,” “others have even worse problems,” “others are depressed,” and many other things I’ve heard — but that’s really not the case. Sometimes you really can’t handle it on your own, especially as a child — you don’t understand what’s happening to you.

Volunteer: I think the fact that something is stigmatised — and especially mental health — somehow motivates us to destigmatise it, or at least to want to destigmatise it, because I think we have a certain sense of respect that isn’t necessarily the same as what our parents or relatives have, we want to push each other harder. And I know what Mara was saying about us being called “snowflakes” — I think this is because we tend to hold people accountable for the mistakes they make, and we want to help people grow, learn, and educate themselves about certain things they may not have known before — and that includes mental health education —something that nobody is doing right now, especially in the educational system.

Larisa: And do you think, in any way, that anxiety—as opposed to normal, healthy stress leading up to an event like an exam — manifests itself in many students, at least in part, precisely because mental health isn’t discussed, there are no resources, and there’s a lack of awareness that mental health can play an important role in performance?

Volunteer: Yes, I think the system is set up in such a way that it doesn’t take into account people who feel this way, and I think many people — including me — wouldn’t have anxiety if we’d been taught, when it first appeared, how to manage it and cope with it, and had been told that it’s okay to feel this way. I mean, there’s also this stereotype that you’re crazy if you have these kinds of issues, if you go to a psychologist, if you want to go to a psychologist, or to the school counselor. I think people don’t go because they’re afraid that X classmate will see them in the hallway and say afterward, “Look who went to the school counselor.” So I think there are certain factors — from a social perspective and in terms of the social hierarchy in schools — that push people who are starting to feel anxious to become even more anxious.

Volunteer: I don’t think it’s an inclusive system. It puts a certain model in front of you and, if you don’t fit that model, then somehow you’re the problem. You’re expected to be a certain way, and there’s no other option. And if you’re not like that, you’re the one who has to do certain things to become that way. It’s seen as your problem, not theirs.

Volunteer: I wanted to talk a little about the exams other than the National Exam at the end of 8th grade and the Baccalaureate, which are included in the curriculum. We’re talking about the tests we’re expected to take, like the Cambridge exams or those for foreign languages. In order for us to go abroad, we have to take extra tests, and that’s an extra effort on our part, and I don’t think there’s any understanding at all regarding this. It’s, once again, a very rigid system, and no one is going to help you — it’s your problem. It’s your problem if you want to take them, but if you don’t, you lose out — it’s a vicious cycle you get caught up in. And if you want to take them and do well, you have to do it all while juggling 10 other subjects at school — where you’re required to do certain things — and another 7 that you’re required to attend and study for.

Volunteer: I’d like to add something about the exam material itself: it seems to me that we focus so much on grades and results that we forget that what’s on the exam is pretty useless—I mean, you don’t really retain much, whether it’s in Romanian or math. At least for us, when we started high school, our teachers said they didn’t care about our entrance exam scores, because they don’t mean anything— they don’t show that we know math, and they don’t show that we know Romanian. And they say exactly the same thing about the Baccalaureate — that the exam questions basically won’t have anything to do with math or Romanian or whatever subject we’re taking for the Baccalaureate. Yeah, and that seems ridiculous to me, because why would you take an exam if, as a person, it doesn’t help you grow in any way, get any knowledge, just to learn something you’re going to forget right away?

Mara: I wanted to add, in reference to what Amelia said, that we’re indeed told that the Bac is the high school graduation exam, that it’s a very important milestone. And we start to wonder what exactly it’s preparing us for — I mean, does maturity mean knowing the year a certain poem was published or all sorts of details related to literature, or does it mean being mature as a person? I mean, I think it kind of just throws you into life without teaching you what’s essential. And, regarding pre-exam stress, yes, I think it’s hard for many students to channel their anxiety constructively, and stress can drag them down — which is why I think it’s very important that during that year, in 8th grade or 12th grade, certain secondary subjects should be replaced with things like mental preparation for what’s to come and learning to channel emotions and focus, so that you prepare the children on all levels and teach them that, yes, the exam is important, but it’s just as important for them to understand that their lives don’t end with that exam — it’s not their ultimate goal.

Larisa: Thank you so much for all your answers and contributions so far! We’re coming to the end of today’s episode, and, to wrap things up, we’ve talked about the 8th grade exam, the tests you have throughout high school, as well as the rigidity of the education system and how mental health and the role of psychological factors in academic performance and in our personal and professional lives aren’t given as much attention as we would like. So, to finish off the episode, we wanted to ask you: if you could change just one thing about the education system to improve students’ mental health, what would it be?

Mara: As I said before, I would eliminate — at least in the final years — the subjects that, how should I put it, have been somewhat secondary over the years. I think everything could be condensed into the first three years of high school or middle school, and I’d replace them with more recreational activities, including sports, art, mindfulness and breathing techniques, and sessions for very open discussions about how students are feeling — so there would be more emphasis on this openness regarding emotions and mental health.

Volunteer: I’d like it if, starting in 5th grade, at least once a month, every child had the chance to talk to the school counselor and somehow express what’s on their mind — maybe they don’t know which direction to take, what career to choose, or maybe they’ve had a conflict with someone at school or with a teacher and are confused — in other words, for someone to help them understand their emotions, because it’s hard, after all, and people expect us to figure it out on our own.

Volunteer: I think I’d change the way the subjects are organised a bit; that is, it seems to me that there are a lot of subjects in general, and they’re mandatory — so I’d have each person choose a certain number of courses each year, I don’t know, 6 or 7 — whatever number they feel they can focus on — and subjects they’ll actually enjoy. Again, if they want to choose art, they can choose art; if they want to choose M1-level math — I like math, I want to take math — but I don’t like physics; yet I have three hours of physics a week. The system was designed unilaterally; nobody actually asked us which subjects we want to take.

Volunteer: I think the structure of the exam should be changed — that is, both the National Exam and the Baccalaureate — because everything is based on memorisation and there’s nothing creative about it. And when you compare it to other countries, at least somewhere there’s some sort of creative exercise — in Romania that’s not the case; at least for Romanian language and literature, it’s based on cramming commentary essays for both the National Exam and the Baccalaureate, and if there were something more creative, it would definitely reduce the stress, because, yeah, obviously you go in there and do something — you write something that you’re feeling in that moment — rather than something you spent three hours struggling to memorise on a Saturday, when you could have been doing something completely different.

Volunteer: My advice to 8th graders is to believe in themselves and to realise, in the end, that grades don’t matter and don’t define us; what matters is getting into a good place where they’ll meet people who share their interests and where they’ll be able to grow.

Volunteer: To the 8th graders — if I may say so — I’d like to wish them lots of calm and peace, and encourage them to focus on the fact that the 8th-grade exam doesn’t define who you are as a person.

Rodica: Thank you for all your answers and for sharing your thoughts; we hope this will have the impact we’ve all been hoping for in our organisation and that it will bring to light the issues that need to be addressed! Thank you for listening to us so far, and we look forward to seeing you in the next episode. Until then, take care of your mental health!